Let's Talk Fundraising
Welcome to "Let's Talk Fundraising" with Keith Greer, CFRE! This podcast is your go-to resource for mastering the essentials of fundraising while discovering how innovative tools and technology can supercharge your efforts. Whether you're a new fundraiser looking to level up your skills or a seasoned professional seeking timely reminders and fresh insights, each episode is packed with practical advice, creative ideas, and inspiring stories.
Join Keith as he explores the core principles that drive successful fundraising and uncovers the latest strategies to make your job easier, more enjoyable, and incredibly impactful. From relationship-building and storytelling to leveraging the newest tech, "Let's Talk Fundraising" is here to help you transform your approach and achieve remarkable results for your organization.
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Let's Talk Fundraising
Redefining Board Success: From Recruitment to Engagement with Phelosha Collaros
Unlocking the secrets to managing effective nonprofit boards, our episode promises to transform your approach to board recruitment and engagement. With our insightful guest, Phelosha Collaros, we uncover how to transcend the traditional focus on financial capacity and instead recruit board members driven by passion and alignment with your mission. This discussion challenges the norm, advocating for a nuanced, staged pipeline approach to recruiting, where financial commitment is just the starting point for identifying true mission champions.
Prepare to rethink your onboarding strategy with lessons from the seasoned expertise of Phelosha Collaros. Transitioning from basic orientations to a more structured and comprehensive onboarding program, we detail the essential steps your organization needs to cultivate dedicated board members right from the start. By crafting tailored welcome emails, hosting informative orientation sessions, and setting up mentorship opportunities, your nonprofit can ensure a seamless integration that fosters long-term engagement and accountability.
Finally, delve into the intricacies of board engagement and governance with actionable strategies to elevate your board’s effectiveness. From candid conversations and peer counseling to utilizing anonymized surveys for honest feedback, this episode is packed with innovative ideas to keep board members motivated and mission-aligned. Discover how redefining fundraising roles and celebrating successes can transform your board’s fundraising potential without overwhelming them. Tune in to gain valuable insights and practical advice from Phelosha Collaros on cultivating a board that not only supports but champions your organizational goals.
Association of Governing Boards
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Hey, there, hi, and welcome back ambitious fundraisers. Today we're diving into a topic that can make or break the success of your nonprofit managing your board. Let's face it, your board of directors has the potential to be your organization's greatest asset or its biggest challenge. So how do you recruit, engage and empower a board that's truly aligned with your mission and ready to roll up their sleeves? That's exactly what we're unpacking in today's conversation. We'll tackle some of the toughest questions around board management. How do you identify board members who are more than just their financial capacity? What makes a truly great board member, and how can you cultivate a culture of engagement and accountability that keeps your board inspired and active long-term? Grab a notebook and settle in. You're not going to want to miss this one. So let's talk fundraising with our special guest, Phelosha Collaros.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I'm thrilled to welcome today's guest, Phelosha Collaros, to the show. Phelosha serves as the Vice President for Board Governance and Strategic Outcomes at St John's College, which has campuses in Annapolis, maryland, and Santa Fe, New Mexico. In this role, she's at the helm of the college's governance structure, ensuring strong communication and policy management with the Board of Visitors and Governors. Beyond that, Phelosha is a connector, building meaningful relationships with individuals and organizations who share a passion for lifelong learning, a mission St John's College is so well known for. Before stepping into this role, she served as the college's vice president for advancement and alumni relations, and she also brings a wealth of experience from her time as the foundation director for the American Society of Radiologic Technologists. With degrees in business and public administration from Walden University and certification as a Quality Improvement Associate, Phelosha brings both expertise and heart to every facet of her work. Phelosha, welcome to Let's Talk Fundraising. I'm so excited to have you here.
Phelosha Collaros:Oh, Keith, I'm so excited to be here. Thank you so much for the invitation. I'm looking forward to our discussion today.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Absolutely, and I just kind of want to jump right in and many nonprofit leaders search for potential board members based on the person's capacity to give. The belief is that if they get involved on the board, that they will naturally want to support the organization with an increase in their own philanthropy. What do you think of this strategy? How does it fall short, and what is a better way to approach identifying board members who are truly invested in the organization's mission?
Phelosha Collaros:Yeah, I think that the answer to why it falls short is a simple one, but the context on what to do about it is probably much more complex and we'll spend some time on that. I think that the short answer is you know, just because somebody has financial capacity, it doesn't guarantee that they're going to be mission aligned with your organization. It doesn't guarantee any engagement or commitment. So financial capacity is an indication of financial capacity.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Full stop, and that's it.
Phelosha Collaros:That's it period. Financial capacity, full stop. That's it Period. So if you really are trying to understand, you know how do you go around that shortcoming. I think first we have to be honest with ourselves of what drives that right.
Phelosha Collaros:Why are we doing this in our organizations?
Phelosha Collaros:Because we are and I think that is the complicated context because many, if not most, nonprofits you know context, because many, if not most, nonprofits you know, have deep financial needs and the board is usually a very strong piece of the puzzle on how those financial needs are met.
Phelosha Collaros:So I think for many of us, financial capacity really is a significant part of the conversation of how we are going to compose our board so that we can meet the needs of the people we're serving. So, knowing that constraint, knowing that information and knowing that it is also true that transformational gifts, campaign gifts, they are indeed influenced positively by board membership, either by already being a sitting board member or by kind of merging as somebody that's an appropriate leader for the board. So those things are tied together. So if we're going to take for granted that we need board members to give their meaningful philanthropy and we're going to take for granted that major and transformational gifts are positively impacted by board philanthropy, by board membership, by board philanthropy, by board membership. How do we say okay, that granted. How do we not fall into the trap that we're pursuing the wrong people for board membership based on financial capacity? And I think what's most helpful for me is to draw one very bright, specific line, and that is that the gift conversation should happen before anybody is appointed to board membership.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Hope is not a strategy Exactly.
Phelosha Collaros:If you just hold that line right, we're going to have the gift conversation before somebody is appointed to board duties. Then you have that moment where you're able to really assess that commitment and that desire to actually support the organization at a higher level. So hope is not a strategy. Putting someone on the board because you hope they're going to give no, that is the line. I would encourage people to kind of reboot the way they look at bringing on people with financial capacity to the organization, not, as you know, like an open floodgate, but as stages of a board pipeline. So you have your kind of ideal immediate recruitment situation. And that is where you have someone with financial capacity who has a history of philanthropic donations to your nonprofit and they also have the interest and the skills and abilities to serve on a board. That's your short-term recruitment timeframe. Right, they've already signaled the financial commitment. They've already stood out for their expertise or for their volunteerism. That's someone you're going to move along very quickly.
Phelosha Collaros:And you have kind of the short-term recruitment not immediate but short-term and those are people that their giving is maybe new or it's kind of minimal, but they have all these other indications of commitment right, they volunteer for your organization in a sustained way. They're a particular constituent. That's important, right. They could be a parent of a student who's attending your institution. They could be a regular at a lot of different events that the organization puts on gatherings. They're a real strong participant.
Phelosha Collaros:So you have this indication of engagement. Strong indication of engagement. Weaker indication of philanthropy. But that's a good short-term recruitment prospect because you can draw on that engagement and have the conversation about whether they're willing to increase their philanthropic commitment and then kind of put in your long-term pipeline people who have not given to your organization. They have high financial capacity and you see that they give to organizations like yours at a significant level. So they're interested in affinities in terms of mission engagement and that is something to build on. But your next action is not to figure out how to get them on the board. Your next action is to figure out how to deepen the connection between them and your specific organization.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Yeah, and I think that's such an important point to mention that it's not just about the financial commitment, but it's about that connection. How much do they actually care about you? Because something that could look like a big gift to us as fundraisers might be really inconsequential to them and it's really a lack of interest that's not getting them to give it that bigger level.
Keith Greer, CFRE:So I think that's a really important piece to point out, but you've been working with boards for as long as I've known you, which I think is going on like 10 or 15 years at this point it's kind of wild, but in your experience, what are the key qualities or characteristics that make someone not just a good but a great board member for a nonprofit organization?
Phelosha Collaros:Yeah, that's an excellent question. I find that there's a lot of commonalities. So I've had the privilege of working with three different types of boards, right? So an elected board, so board of directors that's actually elected from membership. A board of trustees, which is kind of self-appointed in an organization and more kind of like a I would say like an advisory council type of board, so board members who are chosen for their connection to the organization with a different, like, for example, corporate sponsorship type of role. And so all of those are.
Phelosha Collaros:They're very different in terms of the individual reasons why you're going to bring people onto a board. But there's some significantly strong commonalities and I would say you know, the first one is really mission alignment. Right, that they do have that interest, that engagement with the mission, that they're really looking for furthering the cause or the vision of the organization and they're not in it for personal gain. I think that's very important. It's not a soapbox for them or they're coming in with some type of agenda. They really believe in the organization, they really believe in the mission and the people you're trying to serve. The second one, I think, is accountability. Really great board members. They show up, they're there at the meetings, they're prepared for those meetings, they've read the things in advance that they're supposed to read, they're prepared to ask intelligent questions. They're kind of getting below the surface because of their continuity of engagement and accountability. And that is really important. And I would say, you know, right now we're reassessing our governing documents at St John's College and one of the questions we're asking is should we have a different type of group that are not working board members, that are not governing board members, of folks that we want to acknowledge or keep close to the organization but not just give them that title? Because the accountability of being a governing board member to do the work, to do the readings, to show up, is not the same as someone you want to put in because they have affluence and influence and you just want them to be in your orbit. So kind of making sure the difference between somebody you want to engage and a great board member is somebody who's going to bring that accountability.
Phelosha Collaros:The next one I'd say is a strategic mindset. They really have to get beyond the day-to-day and think long-term, like what is the sustainability, what is the enduring part of this organization that we're going to steward into the future? And that can be sometimes hard for some board members who get a little fixated on maybe something that's happening right now or a specific thing that they might be concerned about in the moment. Really, taking that long view is critical for board members, and a great board member can connect the short-term things that are happening with that long-term view of how we're going to be successful. And I think the final thing I would highlight is they really need to have a collaborative nature right.
Phelosha Collaros:So boards function as a collective and they bring that collective wisdom to the table and they can only act for their organization as a collective, not as individuals. So in order to be effective as a board member, you have to know how you're going to work with the other board members, how you're going to work with the staff, how you're going to work with the chief executive or president at the organization and how you're going to interact with stakeholders. In a way. That's all very positive reaffirming keeping accountabilities where they need to be kept, but also moving things forward together, really reducing any type of unnecessary friction, which is not a difference of opinion, but it is like anything that will drag the organization back from because somebody wants to act as an individual as opposed to part of a group, a collective that is stewarding this organization together. That's going to hold someone back from being a great board member. But once they master that skill of working in committees, in working groups, with presidents and staff, then they're a very powerful actor for the organization.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I wish you could just share that message to all potential board members of like. You're part of a group here. This is not about you and your interest.
Keith Greer, CFRE:It's about what is best for the organization. That's such an important one. But I really liked what you were talking about how you're evaluating a potential new kind of structure to bring in people who might not want to be part of the organizational influence or organizational management, but they still want to have some kind of influence and be able to show their commitment and their passion, and I think that's a really important thing, because not everybody wants to do the heavy lifting that a board necessarily has to do, and not everybody's qualified to do it either, but they can still be passionate about supporting it in other ways.
Phelosha Collaros:Exactly. I mean, every board member has a fiduciary responsibility for the organization, right? So that means you ought to review the 990. You ought to review the financials. If that is not for you, you ought not to be on a board.
Phelosha Collaros:Right, right Find out other ways to volunteer and hopefully the organization can provide those ways for you to be involved in events or in other type of task forces or advisory groups, you know, so that we can, you know, tap into your talent and your passion, but not have the same stringent requirements that a governing board needs to meet.
Keith Greer, CFRE:So, as you're kind of looking at these two introducing this new structure, what strategies do you recommend for recruiting board members who are not only influential or financially capable, but also deeply aligned with the organization's mission and values?
Phelosha Collaros:Right. So you know, I think, that to find these mission aligned board members you really do have to have like a strategic relationship driven approach. Right? So that means you're going to need to, you know, identify the skills that you're looking for, open up your networks and, just, you know, make sure that you are finding the right fit for your organization at the current time. Right, so there you know, as an organization grows and evolved, and especially if you're you know some, a place like St John's college that's been around you know decades, with a new program and it's the third oldest school in the country you know that there's going to be a lot of changes, that the organization is going to face changes to the external environment and that's going to change who you need on your board.
Phelosha Collaros:So what we've done is we've actually worked through the. We have a trustee and governance committee and they're not only charged with the board pipeline and kind of nominating candidates for election to the board, but they're also recently taken on a project, which they've completed, to create two seminal documents. One is a board composition guideline for internal use by the Trustee and Governance Committee, where they looked at who are we looking for at this time in our current landscape at the college. When we look at the overall composition of the board, what do we want that overall makeup to be, very concretely, in terms of skills and demographics and professional background and constituency relationship to the college. What is that rounded picture that we want?
Phelosha Collaros:When we look at the full board, to say we were able to achieve as a composition, full board composition, so that guideline is for internal use. And then we have an external document that we can share with all of our board members, all of our staff members and any potential trustees, which is more like a job description. So it's a leave behind. You can have a conversation with somebody about the board. You can leave it behind with them. If somebody says, oh, I'd like to help you find board members, we give it to them and so that they really have a concrete sense of who we're looking for. You know, really, without that type of clarity, which is the first step for an organization, you need to ask people to open their networks and to recommend and nominate board members. You're going to get much more high quality candidates because they are going to be looking for who you're looking for.
Keith Greer, CFRE:And so once you have those people that you've identified and you're bringing them into the fold you've had that conversation about giving is part of being on the board. How do you approach onboarding new board members, and what does an effective onboarding process look like to ensure they're fully engaged from the start? Because if they are starting off on the wrong foot, it's very easy for things to go astray. So how do you get there?
Phelosha Collaros:That is so true and I think you know, all of us can relate a little bit to an experience of being somewhere and something starts happening and you think this is not what I expected. No, this is not what I signed up for. So you do not want your board to have that experience, a board member to have that experience, because I'm sure basically all organizations have a cap on how many board seats they have. So if you put someone in a board seat, that means somebody else didn't have that seat, and so you want to make sure that there's complete alignment between the person who took that seat and what their expectations are and what your expectations are of them, and so that I think that starts yeah, that starts with the first conversation when you're inviting them to the board, and then it's just reinforced all through this onboarding process. I also have to say, keith, that I really liked that you used the term onboarding and not orientation, because that was a real kind of revelation for us going through the pandemic and coming out the other side of that.
Phelosha Collaros:Prior to the pandemic, we had an orientation. It was like two hours the afternoon before the board meeting started. We gave them their binders, we walked through the materials and we asked for questions and and that was it. And then you know, have a great weekend, guys. You know, um, what the pandemic did, was it? It just really disrupted the notion that you can take for granted that your board culture is going to transfer between new board members and sitting board members. That's gone now.
Phelosha Collaros:So you have to be a lot more intentional on how are you going to acclimate board members to their role and to how the board functions and how to be productive contributing board member, member and how to have that high, highly effective board.
Phelosha Collaros:So we completely changed our mindset from having an orientation to having an onboarding program and now we have several, several steps to that basically.
Phelosha Collaros:So it starts once somebody is elected, they get a welcome email from the organization that really lays out what their year of onboarding is going to look like and you know what kind of resources that are going to be made available to them. So after that email, then they're going to get a packet in the mail that's going to have their board handbook. That's going to contain a welcome letter from the chair, a welcome letter from the presidents, laying out the strategic priorities of the organization at this time. It's going to have an organization chart. It's going to have the description of all the committees, a description of our polity document and, I think really very importantly, a description of the individual trustees' roles and responsibilities and the board's roles and responsibilities and as distinguished from the roles and responsibilities of the president, because that's something that can be a little confusing for new board members is what are the nuances between the dividing lines between the board and the executive of the organization?
Keith Greer, CFRE:So that comes to them yeah, what's that difference between governing and operations?
Phelosha Collaros:Exactly 100%. So that comes to them for a pre-read and then we do an orientation. At the orientation, it is the new board members, the chairman of the board, the presidents and the leadership of trustee and governance and myself. So we'll go through all their questions that they've now accumulated since their pre-reads and then they're assigned a mentor, and that mentor, who's a sitting board member, will have a sidebar conversation with them, either in person, depending on locality, or online prior to the first board meeting, and we'll check in with them at every board meeting, if not after every board meeting, to see how that experience is going to see what questions they have. I mean, really, in terms of the best thing you can do with this onboarding process is make sure to catch deviations early, right.
Phelosha Collaros:So, someone's not having a good experience or they're confused, they're going to start to disengage in that first year. So what are you setting up to make sure that disengagement does not happen in that first year? And then I would say, the final thing that we do is not just for new members, but it's such a powerful piece of onboarding but we keep it for all board members and that is a mission engagement session. So every board meeting now and this was a brainchild of our sitting chairman of the board, we take two hours out of the board weekend to have a session that reconnects the board members with the mission of the organization. So, from you know, being a college, they have done a lab. They've, you know, done a lab that students would do. They've done a language tutorial that students would do. They've, you know, done a lab that students would do. They've done a language tutorial that students would do. They've also done a kind of an immersive experience into public safety, like what's the day in the life of a public safety officer and how does that improve the student experience They've done, you know, we are not known for our sports.
Phelosha Collaros:We're not the St John's College University of the basketball fame but you know what does athletics mean to the program? What does the whole body, mind, spirit, trifecta mean for the education of a whole human? And this coming board meeting we'll be devoting those two hours to strategic visioning and planning so that mission engagement session you can have. Prior to this, a board meeting was a series of committee meetings and an executive session and a plenary session. So you just did. You know finance and audit and all that that's important. But to have that moment to step back as a full board and really reengage with the mission has become such a powerful piece of both onboarding new members and also keeping kind of a board culture going over time.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I really like what you were saying there about making sure that you have the culture of the board really well established, because culture eats strategy every day. Right, absolutely, if the culture's off, it's going to fall apart, and I think that's a thing that so many nonprofits forget to focus on, not only with their staff recruitment, but especially with their board recruitment and their board leadership, and so having a focus on that, I think, was really important. But I also want to make sure that I heard you correctly you guys do a full year of onboarding.
Phelosha Collaros:Yes, it is a full year and so the orientation is just the start of it. But the mentorship we really lean on the mentorship to carry the heavy lift of the onboarding for the rest of the year. So it is those constant check-ins at the board meeting or right after the board meeting that really keeps them engaged in that onboarding process and the mission engagement sessions that we do at every meeting.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I think that's so important. In so many places your onboarding or your orientation is literally a one-hour prelude to the meeting, and then that's it. That was us, you're expected to fully engage at the highest levels, but you also have some board members that come from very influential organizations for-profit organizations and so what are some of the key differences between serving on a nonprofit board versus a for-profit board, like maybe that of a bank? How should nonprofit leaders leverage these differences when they're recruiting new members?
Phelosha Collaros:Yes, I think the number one thing that pops into my mind when you ask that question is something that recently happened at the college. We had some students organizing to increase the pay of work studies, and so St John's financial aid is very generous. We actually our last capital campaign, which we completed very successfully the Freeing Minds campaign was specifically initiated to roll back tuition for 10 years. So we really do take affordability seriously. But parents and families and students are still struggling to afford the cost of higher education. So we understand that that's really relevant and see what we can do about those issues as a philanthropy dependent institution.
Phelosha Collaros:But when the students came to advocate for increased wages, they one of them said why can't you take the money that you're paying the board members and just give it to the students instead? Which was a real teaching moment because, hey, there's a key difference between corporate boards and nonprofit boards. You know they, we do not pay our board members. You know they pay us for the privilege of serving on the board. You know, sometimes millions of dollars. So that kind of fundamental switch of of the, the, the organization being some, you know a corporation being something. That's kind of paying you for your expertise to an organization that you are so passionate about, that you're willing not only to give your time as a board member which is not just meetings but the work done between meetings and the preparation but you're also willing to give your treasure to that organization, that you believe in it so much that you're going to make it one of your top three financial priorities. That is a very different relationship and something that's powerful and in a lot of ways, makes the world go round and can't be appreciated enough if people were not making sure these not-for-profit organizations were around with their extraordinary board commitments.
Phelosha Collaros:I'd say the other two things that I would highlight in terms of what's different between the corporate board side and the nonprofit board side is you know it is you know that fundraising role which can take which starts with contributing but can take many different forms right so that there's more of an active role in the financial health of the organization, the mission-driven focus.
Phelosha Collaros:Right so the board members for not-for-profits are more concerned with the community rather than shareholders. Right so their responsibility is to how the nonprofit organization is keeping its status, how it's serving its constituency. And lastly, I think you know we kind of touched on this earlier, keith, talking about the divide between presidents and board members or chief executives and board members, but I think there's also that kind of fuzzy divide, depending on how small your nonprofit is, between board members and staff or governance and management, because the smaller the nonprofit is, the more the board may be called upon to do certain activities or tasks that you might otherwise rely on your larger staff basically to do, and that is another level of commitment and need that is very, very different from the corporate board world.
Keith Greer, CFRE:And when you're talking about board members joining and not being paid for their service, but they're volunteering and oftentimes paying to volunteer. How can nonprofit leaders cultivate a culture of engagement and accountability on those boards when they're paying for the privilege of being there and ensuring that all members are actively contributing to the organization's mission beyond just attending the meetings, if you can even get that out of them?
Phelosha Collaros:Right, right, no, it's a very interesting relationship, which I think goes back to not every donor should be on your board. First of all, right, it can be another risk to the organization when your donors that don't have maybe the perspective and fortitude to deal with difficult issues are on your board, because it can encourage an organization not to bring difficult issues to their board, and that's what they're there for. So if you have donors that you feel should not be grappling with the organization's issues of sustainability and endurance or other issues that a governing board might need to address, having to do with policy or anything like that, then they really shouldn't be your board member. Find another way to engage and inspire that high net worth individual who's giving you money, so you don't create a board culture of not talking about the truth of what's going on with your organization. So I would say that's number one. It starts with those clear expectations and picking the right board members to be on that board in the first place, and the onboarding process that we just talked about as well, to make sure that they're empowered and informed to take on that role.
Phelosha Collaros:And then I would say, when board members deviate from those expectations that you laid out, as in your job description and in the onboarding process, then they need to be addressed right. So, again, like you said, when it's donors it can be uncomfortable, but one of the best solutions to having a board member counseled is to have another board member do it, because they're also a donor. We would leverage, like our chair of the board or our leadership and our trustee and governance committee to have those conversations. Certainly, a president can have those conversations and, as the stakes get lower, somebody like myself, a board professional, can have those conversations. But you do need to bring things to people's attention. Sometimes it's just an honest oversight or the board member's very busy and they need that reminder. I would say like 80% of accountability boils down to gentle and relentless reminders.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Very similar to fundraising.
Phelosha Collaros:Exactly, exactly. And then I'd say the other thing I'd talk about in terms of a significant step for us in terms of increasing engagement and accountability which many of our listeners may not know about, but I really encourage them to check it out is our relationship with the Association of Governing Boards. So you can find them at agborg. I'll note for your listeners specifically that they have a wealth of resources not only for board governance but also for that intersectionality between boards and fundraising professionals, such as the development committee or advancement committee, how to construct that, what the expectations should be. So I think it's really worth checking out for fundraising professionals who have board adjacent responsibilities, or maybe even staffing an advancement or development committee, to utilize AGB as a resource to know more how to do that, set that up, you know, guide it and how to separate what a board's oversight role in the fundraising and development spaces and what the staff's role and the president's role in the oversight of the actual operations and management of the development or advancement space. I think it's really important. I would also say, huge advancement for us with them was they now do our annual trustee survey. So we used to do this survey in-house Okay, and it was better than nothing, but it was obvious that people weren't entirely forthcoming when we would ask them improvement questions, right, like questions around what's not working or you know what, uh what they would like us to do instead. Um, it's the the kind of more difficult questions on the survey were the least answered or the least early answered. So, going to AGB AGB was able to anonymize our trustee survey for us so we can ask, we can rate all of our different goals on a dimension where we see the board rankings, both individually and collectively, and see how we're really, how they really think we're doing, in addition to verbatim comments that are now very candid, and that's helpful, because when you get candid comments and you get candid rankings, you can really assess what needs to be fixed. I'll point out a couple of things that a survey assesses leadership and shared governance, institutional sustainability and board performance. So having that feedback in writing and those scores, that's a way to really see with clear eyes where your issues are versus.
Phelosha Collaros:What can sometimes happen is certain board personalities get dismissed and not taken seriously as if this is a global concern. I'll give you one example, if I may. Yeah, so we had had a couple of board members that for years were complaining that they felt that our board was kind of homogenizing ideologically and those concerns were dismissed Like no, no. For St John's it's really important to have, you know, diverse ideological diversity and identity diversity. As a school it's important to us and so when we did our last AGB survey, in addition to all the other kind of demographic questions, we're able to ask that people might not be comfortable sharing with, identifying information like disability, sexual orientation, things that now a lot of grant making organizations actually are asking you in terms of the composition of your board, are you having that kind of diversity? We put in a question about self-described political identity on a scale from highly liberal to highly conservative, and we thought this is another identity question that we can ask and get some candid feedback on in terms of all of our demographics.
Phelosha Collaros:And sure enough we had homogenized and so that's not consistent with the values of our organization where we want people from all of those different ideological and political perspectives, because it's in that difference than an organization, especially like ours, can prevent having blind spots. When you have all these different voices at the table, many different dimensions of diversity, you're going to be able to better serve your students better welcome your families and better provide the education that you claim to provide in our case. So those kind of metrics for an organization to be accountable are very valuable. And then that kind of data for the trustee of governance committee and for the executive of the committee of the board to say hi, this is actually the data. So we're going to ask our trustees to be more accountable to improving this data and we're going to ask the board to be more accountable to proving this data where we see deficiencies, and we're going to put together a plan to do that so you can develop something actionable once you know where the data is showing you. You need improvement.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Yeah, and so thank you for bringing up the AGB, which is the Association of Governing Boards. Is that right? Yes, that's correct. Yes, okay, we'll provide a link to them in the show notes as well, just in case anybody wants to check them out. Excellent, but I wanted to get your take on something also. With board members coming on, should there be a clear expectation that they are going to be fundraisers for the organization, or does not everybody need to play that role? But if they do, how do nonprofits effectively communicate and support this expectation without overwhelming them, because so many people are terrified of fundraising.
Phelosha Collaros:No, I know, I mean, I think it's. So. I think the first challenge that organizations have in relation to their board and fundraising is to redefine what fundraising means to the board in the way that fundraising actually means it. But for some reason nobody, no lay person, thinks of this right. So you'll know this, keith, better than anyone Fundraising is not just the ask for money.
Phelosha Collaros:It is for at least four things right the identification, the cultivation, the ask and then the stewardship. And so when you see fundraising as that whole continuity of activities, it's very easy for the board to find their place somewhere you know. Help us identify supporters that's completely doable. Help us cultivate them that can be as little as advocacy or talking up the organization to your networks. It could be hosting an event in your home or your office where the organization can get together donors and potential donors. It can be on the stewardship side. It can be just how they engage with the community or your constituents at events to raise confidence in the organization, to create a welcoming environment and a culture of mutual support and excitement for the organization's future. So there's so many roles besides the ask that a board member can play. But they don't know that. They hear fundraising and they think that you're going to have them go ask people for money.
Phelosha Collaros:Now, it's also not, I think, in the best interest of staff members to have any board member go ask people for money, because they don't have that skill, so when you find those board members who have that capability, or you are making an ask of a transformational size that you need somebody else who's given a transformational gift to be there, then bring in your chairman of the board, bring in that board member who's a donor to be there at that meeting and to help encourage this person to really seriously consider that ask from a peer-to-peer perspective. As well as the staff member that's there, whether it's a president or an advancement vice president, have them be part of the ask. But I think it's really rare unless you're working at the level of a true kind of volunteer organization where they're going to there's, they're going to go out, they're going to be trained to fundraise and go out and do that. That's great, Give them training. Otherwise it's more like how do you plug in that board member to the full continuity of fundraising activities at the level of their skill and the organization's need and just opening that app aperture of what fundraising means? I'm going to give you a very specific, if I can, Keith, a very specific example of one that even surprised me.
Phelosha Collaros:Yeah, so we brought on a board member who tremendous expertise, diversity. She was just such a fortuitous fit for our board. She was very clear during the initial discussions that she would make us one of her top three philanthropic priorities. But that wasn't going to meet the average of what a lot of our other board members get. But she said I will get, I will get, I'm going to. I may not be able to give it the highest amount, but I'm going to get you some other money.
Phelosha Collaros:And what she did was she gave a pro bono seminar to another individual's work in exchange for that individual, who is a grant writer, who had expertise in a specific grant to write a grant proposal for St John's, to get a grant. That's like $300,000 a year for three years. So it was like this pro bono exchange where she went ahead. She did her workshop, which is highly valued. The person whose organization got the workshop, who is a really extraordinary grant writer, wrote a grant for us and here we are now being awarded that grant, and so that's the kind of participation and fundraising that you don't often think of. How can your board member really help you access resources, maybe in a way that you haven't been able to access them before?
Keith Greer, CFRE:So true, and I think I lost my microphone so I might have switched in the process here. I love that story and kind of talking about how the different ways that people can engage with fundraising beyond actually making the ask is such an important piece of it. But once a board member is on board, what are some strategies to maintain their long-term engagement and keep them passionate about the organization's work? Because sometimes when people see the inner workings they can tend to lose that enthusiasm too.
Phelosha Collaros:Yeah, I mean, a real governing board is going to ask a lot of a board member in terms of grappling with serious issues, dealing with, maybe, financial stressors and strains, dealing with policy stressors and strains.
Phelosha Collaros:It can be hard work and sometimes it can feel overwhelming, you know right. And I think that the first thing I would say is just to make sure to celebrate the positive news with them. Don't get so drowned in the business of a board meeting or the business of the board that you're not taking those moments to talk about what's going really well, to celebrate successes with the board, to make them feel part of those successes and just to make sure to bring some levity in their experience, right. So that can be as simple as you know. Have that cocktail reception after the board meeting gets out, you know, let them decompress, let them have, you know, a glass of wine with you, with their fellow board members, and just really make sure that they have that camaraderie. So we talked a lot about collaboration, but I think the other side of that is camaraderie, and creating events to help them feel that sense of camaraderie with their fellow board members and with the people that they're working with at the organization can help them sustain those relationships through the difficult times.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I think what you were saying about celebrating the successes is so important because with our board, so often we're bringing to them the challenges and the problems and that can get very overwhelming when that's all that you're dealing with. But having those relationships keeps you on board and engaged a little bit better. But then making sure that you're celebrating successes makes it so that it's not a drudge to show up to the board meeting and to continue leading it all the time.
Phelosha Collaros:Absolutely, and I think that's where our mission engagement session really has also brought a new sense of fun. I remember when our chair first introduced us it started to take on a little bit more substantive issues. But when the chair first introduced us he said my rule is that it's fun, yeah.
Phelosha Collaros:So, bringing that engagement session in and having the funniest one that we've done is we actually had them draw and adults. Drawing is hilarious, but art is part of our curriculum. It is not a, it is not an elective, it is a required part. You were going to draw, you're going to draw in labs, and what they did was they had them draw magnolia leaves, magnolia leaves and I remember some of the board members faces when they heard that's the activity they were doing, because adults are.
Phelosha Collaros:So you know, we're just kind of so embarrassed about things we don't feel we're talented about, but they did it. They were like, okay, this is. And I told them it's going to be fun. I don't know if they believed me going in, but coming out you know they just really had relaxed. They really were reflecting on how our curriculum stretches students in a way that maybe other schools don't and that sometimes it's fun to just play around with something you're not good at. That's not your expertise and it's not you know some kind of value you're bringing to their organization. But it's just showing up and being there and being together and, you know, just laughing at how bad you or somebody else in that room is drawing and they deserve that. They deserve that experience.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Absolutely, and so, as we're kind of getting ready to wrap up here, what advice would you give to nonprofit leaders to ensure that serving on their boards is an impactful and meaningful experience for every member and so it doesn't become just a line on their resume of something that they did?
Phelosha Collaros:You know, in addition to some of the things we've touched on in terms of setting them up for success and make sure they have a mentor, and then making sure they are engaged not just in the business of the board but in the mission of the institution and they're feeling that kind of camaraderie and that sense of success, I think the last thing I would probably add is just have that personal relationship. If you're the board professional at your organization or if you're an advancement professional or development professional that intersects with the board a lot, build a personal relationship with your board members. I mean they are humans. Build a personal relationship with your board members. I mean they are humans. They want to feel appreciated on a personal level, not just kind of kudos to the board, but they need to have that connection.
Phelosha Collaros:And it's those little things. It's onesies with your logo at the birth of a child and it's flowers when they're sick or when one of their loved ones passes away, or it's just that text message when you're thinking about them or just checking in to see if they're OK if they miss a meeting. Yeah, they're humans who care and they share your concern for your organization and for your constituents that you're trying to serve. So there should be that fundamental basis of a connection between you and that board member. So don't shy away from making them feel personally, important to you and important to the organization, which is, at the end of the day, not very different from a lot of what you should be doing with your donors.
Keith Greer, CFRE:Right, absolutely Well. I am so thrilled that you are here with us today and to be able to share your expertise on board governance and leadership. I think it's going to be a really valuable conversation for a lot of people that are tuning in, so thank you for being here and thank you for being a part of it.
Phelosha Collaros:Thank you, Keith. It was a lot of fun and I really enjoyed it and I look forward to talking again. I know I and I look forward to talking again.
Keith Greer, CFRE:I know I can't wait for our next lunch. It's going to be fun. I know Exactly so much fun.
Phelosha Collaros:You too, bye, bye.
